Best way to gut inside ceiling panels and repair truss etc.

[JimG]

Question on best approach to refurbishing/rebuilding inside ceiling. I have an older SW/MH. Had a new metal roof completed last year. I need to repair the inside ceiling, there is substantial sagging (not just the panels) also need to replace the insulation and obviously repair some rafters/trusses. Should I just start taking down panels and repair as I go? Is this cost effective for a 1969 SW?

[oldfart]

JIm..there ain't no easy way to do this as far as I know. That being said I have an old 1970 s.w. and I did just that. I ripped down the entire ceiling from stem to stern. Then I replaced ALL the gussets on the rafters... since all the original gussets was just left-over paneling, staples and glue. (read junk..) That was about 14 gussets on each rafter...16in. on center rafters..for 60+ft. Not an easy job! My rafters was bowed nearly 2in. down from the walls to the middle of my home. There's no way to arch the rafters back up in place..trust me. Even a common carpenter can see the bow as my ceiling arches down from outside wall to outside wall. I've larned to live with it. I made a pattern of each gusset and cut up tons of plywood..screwed and glued them all into place. I ran 2x4x10 beams above the rafters to tie them all together. Added in wing-walls to support the additional load. Then I drywalled the ceiling and walls after adding in insulation. Originally my home had 1 1/2in. of insulation in walls, ceiling and floor. (not a typo by the way...just 1 1/2 in. walls, ceiling and floors!) All told I spent about $5000 in just materials alone to renovate a home valued at under $2000 in todays market. I've spent 3 years labor doing this and the job is not nearly finished. I figger I've got about 2 years worth of work to do yet. The upside of this losing financial investment is that I own it..lock-stock & barrel. My cost of heating and cooling have dropped roughtly 300%. Taxes have stayed the same. Take yer time..think it through and make it the best ye kin do. Don't cheat on materials and make it as energy efficient and "no- upkeep" as possible. Audie..the Oldfart...

[JimG]

Thanks for the reply, when you took the ceiling panels down did you also include some type of vapor barrier. For instance is there some type of plastic sheeting between the insulation and the new ceiling?

[oldfart]

Jim, in my case there was indeed a vapor-barrier...just plastic sheeting..tacked to the underside of the rafters..on the upside of the ceiling panels. I tossed that out to. What I wanted to do was install new 3/8in. drywall on the ceiling. And I wanted to glue and screw the new drywall to the rafters. Putting in a sheet of plastic would have prevented me from doing that. I'd be glueing to the plastic sheet... which would be wurfless. I want drywall touching wood with lots of glue and screws. So that's the way I did it. I'm not saying it's correct and I have had some problems. I don't think the problems are caused by the way I did the work, but rather the construction of these homes. The vapor barrier may sound like a good idea..I do not believe it is. Condensation simply builds up in the attic anyway and it is just a matter of time until it finds a route to your new drywall without some means of removing the moisture from the attic. You know this already as your ceiling panels are damaged by this very problem. My answer was to install a gable-end vent fan on one end of my home and a simple gable vent on the other end. Air is drawn the length of the attic and exits along with the moisture. The time to do this update is when the ceiling is all removed. Easy access! Well don't want to make this too long..more to come. YMHS...Audie... the Oldfart.

[oldfart]

Jim you mentioned repairing the rafters. Let me explain something. You're most likely going to find the rafters bowed downward from wall to wall. Mine were bowed down 2in. ! I pulled a chalk-line from wall to wall (at the top of the wall-plate where the rafter sets on the wall) and the line was ABOVE the lower part of the rafter in the center of my home. There is no economical way to correct this. Yes, you can "sister up" new 2x4s from side to side but you won't pull the old rafters up. Ever. I tried it with a 4ton floor-jack and the ends of the rafter will lift right up off the outside walls before you'll ever get the bow out of it. And this will damage the metal roof beyond repair. Just let it be and the drywall will curve to fit. And yes..you'll notice it. Another problem you're going to run into is not all the rafters bow the same. (big sigh here..) Grab up a 6ft. level and run it length-wise along the under-side of the rafters once all the ceiling panels are down. You'll see what I mean. Pull a string the length of the room you're working on (on the underside of the rafters) and the problem becomes even more apparent. Some bow up..some bow down. Pull the string every 2ft. the full length of the room. Shim, grind or sand the rafters to get them reasonably close. On some of my rafters I had to cut out sections and tie in new ones as the drop and bow were so excessive. I rekkin' I spent 2 weeks on just the living-room before I'd waste the time to install the new drywall. (11ft.X15ft.) Now, when it comes time to actually install the new ceiling drywall..rent out a drywall-jack. Trust me. True Value rents them out for about $30 a day. Do it. Even if yer just hanging a single room.. a half-dozen sheets of drywall with friends...do it. You can thank me later. Audie..the longwinded Oldfart.

[Dean2]

Some of the Wisconsin Homes I work on come with a foil-backed sheetrock meant for use on the exterior walls,,I wonder if that would also serve as sort of a vapor barrier? Granted it wouldn't be a 100%-coverage sheet like a wide visqueen but should still serve for that and to reflect radiant heat out away from the interior of the home.

I never took note of the brand of the sheets and would have to ask the dealer here or call Wisconsin Homes to get the name of it. I think a foil-backed sheet would be perfect for any home that has excessive heat build-up in the attic. Coundn't hurt on the exterior walls either for that matter..Dunno cost per sheet either,,only time I ever saw it is in those new homes.

Also do'nt know if it is made in a 5/8" firecode or not.

Dean

[oldfart]

Jim I hope I haven't discouraged you from doing the work you know needs to be done. Yes..it's gonn'a be hard and it's gonn'a take time. Just deal with it. Once the ceiling is opened up is the time to do the work...not later. If you want to install a gable-end fan..do it now and run the new wiring to support it. Give some thought to adding in a solar-powered fan on the other end of the home to assist the gable-end (electric fan) to evacuate the heat/moisture from the attic. (one draws air in..the other exhausts it out..) They (solar-powered) work for free! Yup...I know they're not cheap initally...about $300. Home Depot has them..so do Lowes. In the summer heat they'll cut your cost of cooling by 50% or more...in the winter they may save your new drywall ceiling from condensation. (Priceless!) Thinking of installing a security system/smoke alarm or any other wiring? Do it now. New ceiling lights, fans etc.? Now's the time to do it. Adding in more insulation? Great idea...do it while the ceiling is gutted and open..access is open and readilly available. Now, ever thought of using that build-up of heat in the attic in the wintertime to heat yer home? Check out the Alternative Energy Section and look at my cheap&affordable thoughts on a heat collector. In summer that big expanse of metal roofing is a debit on our cooling costs. In the winter it may be our biggest asset for free heat IF we learn how to use it. Just my rambeling thoughts Jim. Audie..the frugal Oldfart..

[Demolition]

My only advice is from a Demolition standpoint.
Have Plastic Sheets hanging over the doorway of the room.
Have some large trash bags for the Insulation and be sure to
wear Hard Hat, Safety Goggles, Long Sleeve Shirt and Gloves.
The trick is to have a direct flow of debris to the dumpster or
burn barrell. So you dont spend two days picking up nuggets
of sheetrock.