Is my whole house moving?

Mark440 · Mon Mar 19, 2012 7:12 am

I know this sounds odd - but how can you tell if the whole danged house is moving?

House sits on sloped land, with decking on the lower, downhill side.

The "symptom" is showing up along the inside edge of my deck and my front stairs. I trimmed the deck boards back a couple of inches a couple years back - and now along the entire length of the house - it is shoved up hard against the deck edge. Also, my front stairs sit directly on the cross members of the decking (deck boards cut out) and there was some 'play' in the front to back spacing. Now, those stairs are pushed up hard against the outlining deck boards - hard enough I am afraid to pry it out. Bear in mind, the movement is horizontal - not vertical!

I crawled under the house and none of the piers appear to be tilted. The plastic that covers the ground doesn't appear to be stretched or torn. And the deck itself doesn't appear to be listing. The sewer lines don't appear to be 'arched' since the slide is towards the septic. And the water main does not appear to be jilted to one side or the other. Even an outdoor faucet that is attached to the house and has its piping directly into the ground - doesn't appear to be moved or distorted.

The earthen anchors along the back side still have that small amount of play in them (semi-tight but not rigid tight). And I don't even know what to check from there. I'm scared to death the place is going to fall over. (Back right corner is maybe 8 inch piers - but the front left corner is easily 3.5 to 4 ft piers.)

I'm nervous as a cat on a hot tin roof!

Greg · Mon Mar 19, 2012 4:19 pm

From all of your indicators (piers, pipes & anchors, I would say your home is stable. You did not say how or if the deck is anchored, but my guess is that the deck is moving. Then again, with the quality of wood out there it may be possible that the wood is still growing.

Greg

joedirt63 · Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:28 pm

wow seems jst what I'm up against whith my zimmer. but I have no anchors or pillars just block on top of the ground. Had I seen this earlier I'd never would have bought it. now it makes sense why the 2 toilets sat a a 30 degree angle to the floor ,just a matter of time befor I can open my bedroom window and walk into my neighbors kitchen.

Mark440 · Sat Mar 24, 2012 9:35 am

Well, I decided to take the bull by the horns. The guy who 'set' this place is a member in good standing of the nimrod gene pool! That said, the last 8 years has been spent un-nimrodding his messes. The most recent involved removing 2 feet of dirt piled up against the skirting - with absolutely zero structure for retaining. A little rain...and the whole thing collapsed. Fast forward a few months to dig it all out and $1200 to reset the A/C and put in steel skirting....

As for the house moving.... I finally found the smoking gun. A single water faucet with its supply line coming up from the ground with the valve attached to the house. It is leaning to the left over a inch. I unscrewed the mounting brackets attached to the house and it immediately sprang back.

And that's when I remembered that long, long, long 3/4" pvc line that runs on TOP of the ground - with no insulation. It runs from that leaning faucet about 40 feet to the faucets mounted on the deck skirt. At least the nimrod did put in a shut off valve.

I called a company to have the place re-leveled. $750 to start. Ouch. I would do it myself - but being from Kansas - well, I have this danged phobia about houses falling...not to mention the venom spitting, Jurassic Park snakes that live under there ! (FWIW - I killed two six footers this last year out by the duck enclosure! SIX feet!!!)

Greg · Sat Mar 24, 2012 12:26 pm

Mark, I would at least go under and check to see just how far off it is. With a water level it really does not take that long to take the readings. That way you know what you are dealing with and you are not relying on a contractor.

Greg

Mark440 · Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:13 am

Greg -

Your advice was spot on - and you are now obligated by decree - based upon the authority passed to me by the Great Wizard of Need ......... Oh boy. What a mess. When I looked under before....well...I'll just say it was sooooo dark....

Five piers along the one side are either leaning - or fallen over. The culprit? Water...as in gulley washer.

The yahoo who set this place basically dug a sloped hole and then backfilled dirt against the skirting on the high sides. But...on the high sides the yard still slopes towards the house. As such, rain water comes in one end...and runs out the other...by the bucket full. The piers that are falling over are along the low edge - which is where all of the water flows through. Lovely. Just lovely.

So...pier footer replacement. The piers are just setting on 18" x 2" square pads. I am of the mind to put down self-poured concrete forms 24" square and a minimum of 4" thick - rebar reinforced. Of course, I'll use the forms to compensate for the slope so the finished footer is top level.

I speculate I can do these one at a time...and am considering replacing the block stacks with the steel jack stands as the new footers will probably settle some so re-adjustment will be needed again.

Might I beg your thoughts? Advice? Warnings?

JD · Mon Apr 02, 2012 11:55 am

You would want your pier footers to be below frost level for your area. This could be 2-4 feet deep. I am sure some parts of Texas are not in Frost Zones.

Mark440 · Mon Apr 02, 2012 12:50 pm

I believe it is 6-8"....but the only thing I could find on-line shows a minimum depth for anywhere in the continental US at 12". So, I will go with safe rather than sorry. Besides, once you are under there digging a hole by hand, what's another 4 - 6" of dirt??

I'm going to use the Maximizer concrete as it shows a higher strength.

Greg · Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:42 pm

[quote="Mark440"]Greg -

Your advice was spot on - and you are now obligated by decree - based upon the authority passed to me by the Great Wizard of Need ......... Oh boy. What a mess.

OK by Proxy, JD is closer to you than I am so I think HE need to come out and take a look

I think you are on the right track to pour new pads and reblock your home. It also sounds like you do some re grading around the home and I don't think 4" perforated pipe is out of the question either.

Greg

canman47 · Tue Apr 03, 2012 11:14 pm

I think even with concrete piers you'll have problems if you can't keep it dry under there. My place sits on pressure treated slabs and it seems to work pretty well. I've relevelled twice in 40 years and it's only been off less than an inch. If you like digging under a mobile then who am I to stop you but I think properly installed slabs are fine. I put down a couple buckets of road base then (2) 2x12x24 slabs. Then an 18" slab perpindicular, then the blocks. It never freezes under the house even in the teens so I don't worry about frost heave. Also, I heard something interesting from a local dealer. He was repairing mobiles after an earthquake in Washington. He said that all the damage was on homes using metal jack type stands. None of the homes on concrete blocks failed. He's gone back to installing them on concrete blocks.

joedirt63 · Sat Apr 28, 2012 11:22 am

yeah Mark french drain will work . just did mine . I got the very same problem you described, I used 70 feet of 4 inch pipe from the back to the front, on the side the rain water floods in. ( mountain on the back and side of lot). seems to work well ,not much rain here yet just about 3 inches this past week end. enough to show me that my water diverting systems works. Now I have to put in those pillar footings

Mark440 · Mon May 28, 2012 8:46 am

"None of the homes on concrete blocks failed. He's gone back to installing them on concrete blocks."

That is very interesting. North Texas isn't prone to earthquakes - still - it does make you wonder about the stability of the steel jacks. I guess it has to do with the limited 'contact' surface of the jacks vs the blocks??

This project is moving very, very slowly. I had to have 4 trees cut down (one dead, one leaning over the house, and the other two were nuisance weeds that turned into trees). With the trees gone, I am re-evaluating the uphill landscaping with regards to water diversion....and I see many, many 'tiers' in my future.

As for the pads, my biggest problem is access. The north side is blocked by back-filled dirt on the plastic skirting plus a whole row of very thick shrubs. The east and south sides are blocked by continuous decking. The west side - well, I just finished putting up steel skirting a couple months back (before the rains). I tell ya, there are days I'd like to hire a huge crane just to suspend this pup about 10 feet up in the air for a few months to do it all "right" and without all the danged hassle of 40 'projects' in front of the one you need to do.