cinch clamps vs crimp for pex

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Craigrrr
Posts: 38
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 10:29 am

Sat Oct 22, 2016 4:06 pm

Looking for the pro's and cons of Cinch clamps or the use of crimp clamps on pex pipe and
also wanted to know if the PEX A Aquapex wirsbo is the same diameter as the pex red and blue sold at the big orange box store? as that guy at the big box store said they are different sizes???

I think he is wrong but then I never used them only going by internet so any help here is appreciated.

I wanted to edit this as I was thinking of using Stainless cinch clamps on wirsbo pex a pipe , that guy at the depot did not know if his pex was A B or C I did not know there was a difference


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Greg
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Sun Oct 23, 2016 9:35 am

I am not sure if there is a size difference or not, if so I would suspect it would only be a few thousands of an inch so you should be able to seal it with no problem. Just buy the fittings & clamps for the tube.
As for the clamps, it almost seems to be an East/West coast thing. I used crimp type here & JD seems to favor the cinch type in California. Booth seem to do the job.

Greg
"If I can't fix it, I can screw it up so bad no one else can either."

Craigrrr
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Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2016 10:29 am

Sun Oct 23, 2016 3:56 pm

Thanks Greg.

can the plastic fittings be used with a cinch clamp or crimp ring ? I have seen them by the pex sold at HD , but I can not get a straight answer out of the kids that work there, they keep sending me to the shark bites LOL

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Greg
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Mon Oct 24, 2016 6:25 pm

I only use Brass inserts.

Greg
"If I can't fix it, I can screw it up so bad no one else can either."

Craigrrr
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Mon Oct 24, 2016 8:43 pm

Sounds good, Greg Brass it will be! now to decide on cinch , expandable or crimp.


Markfothebeast
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Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:54 pm

The cinch clamp tool is much cheaper. However, the clamps themselves at big chain stores are more expensive than crimp rings. And trust me, $6 for 10 cinch rings will have you running back to the store multiple times. You can purchase a 100 pack of these online for about $20. The cons of the cinch clamps are that they tend to leak much easier than the crimp rings. I've turned a few fittings with the clamps in place and they will potentially leak or weep. This makes me a bit nervous so I never hide a fitting behind a wall or use pex male to male fittings to extend a line.

The crimp rings in my opinion create a tighter and more even seal. The tool is much more expensive than the cinch ring tool. In the long run I would have been much happier forking out the extra dollars for the crimp ring tool. I would have actually saved money because the crimp rings themselves are a couple bucks cheaper in 10 packs.

2 or 3 different times I found myself running out of cinch clamps and had to shut off the water to some fixtures until I could make it back to Menards the next day. I should have opted for the 100 pack. Everytime I decide to make a change to the plumbing I take an angle grinder to cut the clamps off and I'm out a clamp or two. I've also used the cinch clamps on other things like automotive hoses which worked great.

I've used Shark Bite brand or the off brand "Quick Connect" fittings that Menards sells. Both are basically the same thing. I don't trust using these anywhere other than off the water heater or areas I need to disconnect frequently to the 3/4" main copper line. I've actually broken one of the 3/4" fittings and was out $35 for the Shark Bite hose to the water heater. I've never had these leak but I have seen them weep slightly over one years time.

For the money I've invested in to Pex fittings, line, clamps, etc, I could have bought enough 1/2" copper piping and fittings to re-plumb the entire house. But I got real tired of soldering, cutting, and measuring pipe and it takes far too much time.

I stopped over at my neighbors recently and saw that his new home is completely plumbed in Pex type clear line with quick connect fittings hiding in every corner, wall, and ceiling. He'll be dreading the day when these begin to leak from the harsh well water. Clear line is also a bacterial hazard when exposed to light. I use the basic red and blue PEX line. I don't recall the differences between types but I would suggest the red and blue color coded line (it appears to be the cheapest also). I would not think the diameters would be any different between types because the fittings and clamps/rings would need to be differently sized. But then again I've never used it so I can only guess.

Edit: Between Menards and Home Depot I would suggest Menards if you have one nearby. The Depot has a crumby plumbing selection. If an employee at either store isn't sure about something I always find a plumber shopping in the plumbing isle that is helpful.

tumbleweed
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Sat Dec 17, 2016 10:04 am

I'll chime in with what I've learned through recent experience with PEX plumbing. 1. All pex is NOT created equal. OR installed equally for that matter. Type A is the really cool stuff, but requires a special tool to connect "the best" way. AN EXPANDER tool, and they are not cheap. BUT it is hands down the most fail proof way to install pex. You put a nylon collar on end of tube, expand and insert on fitting, and it shrinks back down. ONLY type A can do this. Type A also is more flexible and can be bought in sticks or rolls. Sometimes, you can make a loop instead of using an elbow. ALSO, concerning diameter of tube and fittings. THe fittings for "EXPANDER" connections are different than the ones you use for the home depot stuff. They are "full bore", meaning you lose no flow versus all other fitting types, which are less than 1/2 diameter. SO, with type A you can use less fittings because you can make a loop instead of an elbow and it comes in rolls eliminating need for a coupling every 10 feet. Less fittings, less flow loss. It all adds up to a noticeable difference, at least for me it did. Also, with type A if you make a kink in your line, you can remove that kink with a heat gun and it will return to "no kink". Kind of like magic. Type B, Type C... kink. gotta cut it out and put another connection. AS for the red and blue stuff and white, it definitely is not Type A. During my research, the bottom line to me seemed to be they were not really sure if it is B or C and C is not even suitable for potable water. The A, B, C thing is determined by how the product is made. I don't recall all the details but it's easily googled. Me, my opinion and through my limited experience, I'll only use Type A with EXPANDER fittings and connections; especially since I now own the $200 expander tool. Hope this helps.

yakima4$
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Sun Dec 18, 2016 11:14 am

If you get tired of paying for all the latest PEX/Wirsbo/flexable tubing and want to simplify installation. Try Flow Guard Gold or any other CPVC type potable water pipe. It is really straight forward . Can of glue and cutters/hand saw and your off and running. Properly installed it is a good system and you do not need to worry about all the compatibility of fittings and special tools required.
I never see a house listed on the market bragging of there plumbing water pipe system.

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Greg
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Sun Dec 18, 2016 1:24 pm

yakima4$ wrote:If you get tired of paying for all the latest PEX/Wirsbo/flexable tubing and want to simplify installation. Try Flow Guard Gold or any other CPVC type potable water pipe. It is really straight forward . Can of glue and cutters/hand saw and your off and running. Properly installed it is a good system and you do not need to worry about all the compatibility of fittings and special tools required.
I never see a house listed on the market bragging of there plumbing water pipe system.
The major problem with PVC/CPVC is freeze ups. PEX is very forgiving.
And yes here in the North East PEX is a selling point in mobiles.

Greg
"If I can't fix it, I can screw it up so bad no one else can either."

tumbleweed
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Sun Dec 18, 2016 8:02 pm

PEX Type A is supposed to be freeze bust proof. If i recall the numbers correctly, frozen water expands 13% and Type A can expand 19% before bursting. And that expansion does not compromise strength in that area, it just goes back to normal size when it thaws. Type B, is pretty much the same as CPVC concerning freezing and bursting. And Type C is not even approved for potable water.

tumbleweed
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Joined: Sun Oct 18, 2009 11:20 am

Sun Dec 18, 2016 8:27 pm

Craigrrr wrote:wanted to know if the PEX A Aquapex wirsbo is the same diameter as the pex red and blue sold at the big orange box store? as that guy at the big box store said they are different sizes???
Probably to just look at them and measure them they would be the same or at least very close but the fittings are different sizes. Type A can be connected in a way B can not. A nylon collar is put on end of tube and expanded open with special tool. The expanded open end is put onto the fitting and it compresses tightly and permanently in less than a minute. Given this enlarges the tube end for connection, "expander fittings" use "full bore" and so yes the 1/2" "expander pex" fittings are different than 1/2" clamp on fittings. Try this method with type B and the tube will burst. Only A can do this. And this is why TYPE A won't burst from freezing, but TYPE B will.

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